Further afield

We decided to look a little further afield this week, visiting parts of Wales outside the Snowdonia National Park for a change.

We were not disappointed by the wreckage on Foel Wen/Mynydd Tarw of Blenheim L4873, though time and the elements has turned what was a fairly complete wing section into a scatter of big scraps of aluminium skinning in the main.

We planned quite a short walk to allow us to search quite widely for the nearby Flying Fortress 41-9098, which we had heard was hard to find from the Doylerush/High Ground Wreck grid reference.

We found it 670m from these coordinates, in a different valley entirely. We also found what we think was the scar on the hillside which caused these author's confusion.

Bristol Blenheim Mk.IV L4873

Blenheim:Mynydd Tarw
Originally uploaded by wreckhunter

Overgrowth by soft rush makes it hard to do justice to this pretty extensive pile of wreckage up on Foel Wen(or possibly Mynydd Tarw) in a photo.


Blenheim:Mynydd Tarw
Originally uploaded by wreckhunter

The bit of metal in the foreground is a main spar from the wing of this bomber aircraft. It's a good sized bit of metal.

Location: SJ 10303 32442

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NOT Boeing Flying Fortress B-17E 41-9098, Westland Lysander Mk.III T1655, or Supermarine Spitfire Mk.IIA P7295

Not Fortress: Bwylch Maen Gwynedd
Originally uploaded by wreckhunter

This scar in Bwylch Maen Gwynedd was close to the coordinates given in "High Ground Wrecks", for three 'planes (Boeing Flying Fortress B-17E 41-9098, Westland Lysander Mk.III T1655, and Supermarine Spitfire Mk.IIA P7295), and looked pretty convincing from a distance.

Close up however, not a trace of metal. It's hard to crash a 16 tonne 'plane into the ground and not leave a scrap of aluminium.

We know this isn't it, but we think this might be what HGW have marked as the Fortress crash site.

Location:SJ 07733 34027

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Boeing Flying Fortress B-17E 41-9098

Fortress: Craig Berwyn
Originally uploaded by wreckhunter

Here's where the Flying Fortress actually crashed, 670m away from the High Ground Wrecks/Doylerush coordinates, and in a different valley altogether. See then next post for our proof.

Location: SJ 07933 33521

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Boeing Flying Fortress B-17E 41-9098

Fortress: Craig Berwyn
Originally uploaded by wreckhunter

Site proving scraps from the scar left when this Fortress crashed: perspex, a buckle, electrical components and various unidentifiable scraps of aluminium and steel.

Armstrong Vickers Wellington Mk.III HF613 coded DD-R

Wellington: Hope
Originally uploaded by wreckhunter

This memorial and the Canadian maple planted in the wooden frame behind it were placed to mark the crash site of this RCAF Wellington in the ford in the river nearby.

The crash site itself threw up a practice bomb a few years back (not a live one as reported elsewhere on the 'net), which was blown up by the army with an unsatisfying explosion, according to witness reports.

Location:SK 16003 83421

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Reims Cessna F.150M G-BFRP

Cessna: Kinder
Originally uploaded by wreckhunter

After the Wellington Memorial we started the day's job of revisiting sites where we had received enough additional information since our last visit to be fairly confident of clearing them.

This is a view down the gully where the Cessna crashed on Broadlee Bank Tor, above Edale.

Whilst we are happy we have found the site ( a fair bit up the gully from the photo location) by photo-matching, metal detection showed there to be not a scrap of tin left at the site.

We don't want our site to degenerate to the state of some others on the 'net where we take a picture from half a mile away of a field and claim to have identified the site, but this pic will help you find the site if you are looking, and we really cannot find any physical evidence at this site.

This was the last remaining site on Kinder which we considered to have a good chance of definitively locating without in-depth research.

Location:SK 11375 86122

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Airspeed Oxford Mk.I R6271

Oxford: Waterhouses
Originally uploaded by wreckhunter

Our second visit to the Waterhouses crash site of this Oxford yielded this scrap of debris.

Access to the site was facilitated by the river being unexpectedly completely dry.

Pat Cunningham's information is a bit poor at this site, probably for the main reason we had such difficulty locating it: the trees on the steep bank block the GPS signal pretty effectively.

His given coordinates are for example 50m below his given elevation data, and on the wrong side of the river.

Our location info at this site is at least on the right side of the river, but it will not be as accurate as usual, maybe +/- 50 ft.

Location:SK 09323 50138

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Aber Falls

Aber Falls
Originally uploaded by wreckhunter

Aber Falls: we had planned to get onto Llwytmor to see the Auster, Botha and Heinkel by going over the top of the falls.

There is a right of way marked, but whilst we might have had a right to follow the route, in the weather conditions on the day we considered it more or less suicidal.

The path through the scree below Marian Rhaeadr-Fawr petered out at a small, deep gorge, and continued only as a steep bed of muddy points of rock over a 150m drop. As we had forgotten our wingsuits, we decided that discretion was the better part of valour.

The more sane ascent by the side of Afon Rhaeadr-bach was not quick enough, and when we realised we were going to run out of daylight, we abandoned the attempt in favour of the Wessex memorial by the side of Llyn Padarn in Llanberis.

We'll have to clear the sites on Llwytmor in summer...

Westland Wessex HC2 XR524 : Llyn Padarn

Wessex:Llyn Padarn
Originally uploaded by wreckhunter

The Monument to the dead ATC cadets from the August 1993 crash of a Wessex training flight from RAF Valley.

The vast majority of sites we visit are from long ago, but this site's newness brought home the tragedy, especially when those who died were so young.

Edward Doylerush's description of the location of the memorial is incidentally extremely unhelpful.

Location: SH 57406 60930

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Boeing Flying Fortress B-17F 42-3134 Memorial: Bala

Fortress B-17F 42-3134 Memorial: Bala
Originally uploaded by wreckhunter

Those who fixed the commemorative plaque to the crew of the Fortress crashed on Arenig Fawr on the Old Town Hall in Bala may not have foreseen its conversion into a Chinese restaurant.

The hoardings unfortunately stopped us seeing if the plaque is still there.

We visited this as a convenient stop-off 50 yards from a cafe where I had an excellent fry-up.

The days' main targets were another Fortress with some controversy as to its identity, and a Lancaster (NE132) which was supposed to be easy to find by virtue of being in quite big bits.

Got the Fortress but not the Lanc. We now understand (from MattZX) that we missed the Lancaster because the High Ground Wrecks coordinates are unusually inaccurate at the site.

Nice walking though, for once dryer and sunnier in Wales than in Derbyshire.

As ever, we'll be back with more info to find the ones we missed on the first pass.

Location: SH 92615 35974

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Boeing B-17 Flying Fortress 44-6005 coded XK-D or 44-8639?

Fortress: Craig Cwm-Llwyd
Originally uploaded by wreckhunter

This unusual stainless steel plaque is reportedly affixed to the wall at the point where an engine rolling down the hill from the crash of a Flying Fortress demolished it.

A number of enthusiast's books gave this site as that of Fortress 44-6005, but we understand that most people now think this is where 44-8639 crashed. (Or is it the other way round?)

The plaque seems to keep out of the controversy over the plane's identity by not giving the aircraft a number.

Location:SH 64343 12395

Boeing B-17 Flying Fortress 44-6005 coded XK-D or 44-8639?

Fortress: Craig Cwm-Llwyd
Originally uploaded by wreckhunter

The scar left on the hillside by the crash of this Flying Fortress.

Location: SH 64434 12245

Boeing B-17 Flying Fortress 44-6005 coded XK-D or 44-8639?

Fortress: Craig Cwm-Llwyd
Originally uploaded by wreckhunter

A home-made memorial and scatter of formerly molten aluminium at the crash site. It seems this plea might have come too late, there's nothing there now longer than around 150mm.

We think the memorial was made by Matt Rimmer, a local champion of wreck site preservation, who was responsible for clearing up the mystery of which aircraft crashed here, in the opinion of Edward Doylerush amongst others.

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